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  • Drone foundation

  • General Q&A, Bee chat and only Bee chat please
General Q&A, Bee chat and only Bee chat please
 #7979  by Liam
 26 Jun 2020, 14:55
As a beginner, I hadn’t realised you could actually buy drone foundation. I had recently brought another hive from Maisemore Apiaries. It arrived and the foundation looked a little different, didn’t pay much attention to it. Anyways, installed the hive and now found out that drone foundation exists!. I think this is a pretty bad mistake for a company to send all drone foundation on a new hive, I just had no idea it even existed.

I’m guessing I’m going to have to remove all frames, replace and start again?. I let a swarm draw out 6 frames of drone brood foundation not knowing :| .
 #7980  by Chrisbarlow
 26 Jun 2020, 15:28
Liam wrote:
26 Jun 2020, 14:55
As a beginner, I hadn’t realised you could actually buy drone foundation. I had recently brought another hive from Maisemore Apiaries. It arrived and the foundation looked a little different, didn’t pay much attention to it. Anyways, installed the hive and now found out that drone foundation exists!. I think this is a pretty bad mistake for a company to send all drone foundation on a new hive, I just had no idea it even existed.

I’m guessing I’m going to have to remove all frames, replace and start again?. I let a swarm draw out 6 frames of drone brood foundation not knowing :| .
you might want to contact maisemores and see if they can help

The foundation will need removing and some worker foundation inserting.
 #7983  by Liam
 26 Jun 2020, 15:55
Ok, thanks, they don’t seem to reply but will give them a chance. Although don’t want to make this a rant it’s been problems from day one: nuc came with swarm cells, no info on what queen it was, my original hive I payed for 2 cedar supers and got pine, my second hive all came with drone foundation. For a beginner it’s been a bit of a disaster so will look elsewhere.

I will just have to buy foundation and swop it all but unlikely the bees will survive now.
 #7984  by Chrisbarlow
 26 Jun 2020, 16:31
You could cut all foundation out and just put empty frames back in if you can't get foundation quickly

But speaking to or emailing maisemores would be best

Simon the Beekeeper has well priced foundation in at the moment
 #7986  by AdamD
 26 Jun 2020, 16:59
Mistakes from maisies, I would hope that can rectify the issues if given the opportunity.

Drone foundation is usually used when someone particularly wants a lot of drones for breeding purposes. For most of us, a super frame in the brood box plus the drone brood the bees produce around the brood is enough. I've never tried ALL drone foundation (and don't think I will now!) - I would have expected a swarm to convert some of it, at least, to worker brood.

Nucs can be 'nice full nucs' one day and then crammed just a few days later - it's a moveable feast. My guess is that your maisies nuc was very full if there were queencells in there. Hopefully you have put this right by now.
 #7988  by Liam
 26 Jun 2020, 18:04
AdamD wrote:
26 Jun 2020, 16:59
Mistakes from maisies, I would hope that can rectify the issues if given the opportunity.

Drone foundation is usually used when someone particularly wants a lot of drones for breeding purposes. For most of us, a super frame in the brood box plus the drone brood the bees produce around the brood is enough. I've never tried ALL drone foundation (and don't think I will now!) - I would have expected a swarm to convert some of it, at least, to worker brood.

Nucs can be 'nice full nucs' one day and then crammed just a few days later - it's a moveable feast. My guess is that your maisies nuc was very full if there were queencells in there. Hopefully you have put this right by now.
The nuc that had drone foundation converted most of it to honey but it was waiting on the queen to be mated. I will check this weekend if they made any worker space, but most likely I will kill this queen and combine the bees, i'm getting a little frustrated and to be honest, I just want a hive that I know is on the right track.

Yes, the original nuc I brought was packed and I sorted that problem back when I first got them and understand this can happen.
 #7989  by Liam
 26 Jun 2020, 18:07
Chrisbarlow wrote:
26 Jun 2020, 16:31
You could cut all foundation out and just put empty frames back in if you can't get foundation quickly

But speaking to or emailing maisemores would be best

Simon the Beekeeper has well priced foundation in at the moment
Ok, thanks, I will cut it all out for now at the weekend, then replace with foundation when it arrives and hope the bees can recover.
 #7992  by AndrewLD
 26 Jun 2020, 21:36
Liam wrote:
26 Jun 2020, 15:55
Ok, thanks, they don’t seem to reply but will give them a chance. ..................., my original hive I payed for 2 cedar supers and got pine, my second hive all came with drone foundation. For a beginner it’s been a bit of a disaster so will look elsewhere.

I will just have to buy foundation and swop it all but unlikely the bees will survive now.
First point: If they are not replying and if you paid on a credit card notify your card company and see what they can do to help......
Second point: are you sure the supers are not cedar? English cedar is very light but even so you should smell the oils in it. If it is pine - demand a refund.
Third point - I'd be wary of cutting out all the foundation, the comb could go anywhere. Try leaving a starter strip in each frame and then cut the rest away.
 #7993  by Liam
 26 Jun 2020, 22:03
AndrewLD wrote:
26 Jun 2020, 21:36
Liam wrote:
26 Jun 2020, 15:55
Ok, thanks, they don’t seem to reply but will give them a chance. ..................., my original hive I payed for 2 cedar supers and got pine, my second hive all came with drone foundation. For a beginner it’s been a bit of a disaster so will look elsewhere.

I will just have to buy foundation and swop it all but unlikely the bees will survive now.
First point: If they are not replying and if you paid on a credit card notify your card company and see what they can do to help......
Second point: are you sure the supers are not cedar? English cedar is very light but even so you should smell the oils in it. If it is pine - demand a refund.
Third point - I'd be wary of cutting out all the foundation, the comb could go anywhere. Try leaving a starter strip in each frame and then cut the rest away.
Yes, my first hive was all cedar apart from the supers, My second hive was all cedar. Im not one to complain much lol so I just let it slide as I was keen to get on with building.

Im going to shake all the bees off and sort the frames at another location, I'm pretty strict on being as clean as possible (ton of wasps here that im controlling with traps) I did consider leaving starter strips but concerned they will build to many drones on the top sections. I have never tried no foundation in brood box, I would need to get my level out for sure lol. I'm not sure there will be time for that hive to recover. I do have another hive with worker cell foundation but it has just re-queened itself so its weak. I hate killing off queens to combine this lot but I might have to. Look on the bright side, I wont be running out of drone foundation for many years.
 #7999  by AdamD
 27 Jun 2020, 08:55
If your queen has only just mated, then there is time for the colony to be strong enough for winter; a brood frame with worker foundation will give her something to get started on a few days before any more foundation arrives. (I would hope that Maisies sends you some)! With a newly laying queen in a colony, they will want brood and not drones, so I would expect that they would draw worker cells from starter strips. These could be just a few mm - something for the bees to get going on in a straight line.